Battle of Preussisch-Eylau (OB)

[Kein Prinz]

Hi all,
First apologies if recalling the 'main' battles is tedious to some, I know I avoid such under the 'French' topic myself, however, I recall this item I have already tagged- Prussian Regiments and have further questions on L'Estocqs corps.

Has there been in more recent times, any improvement of the given data?
1- Missing Generals named?
2- Is the "Russian Regiment of Wyburg" the same 'Viborg Musketeer Regt' that fought under Langeron (Second Column) at Austerlitz? Or another?

I did search the forum for the same names, however not even the first came up. Is 'Search' limited to a specif time range, or should I use Advanced more correctly?

Many thanks, davew

[admin]

There‘s been a thread about the literature about Eylau, where a work of Bastard is mentioned: https://forum.napoleon-online.de/for...n-preuss-eylau

Regarding your questions here, I‘ve to Check the russian sources.

Greetings
Markus Stein

[Kein Prinz]

Thanks Marcus
Yes I'd read that - I have spent last 5 days reading every relevant thread and subscribed to a number of them. Started at oldest and worked my way to current, just so I saw everything. Did the Sections- Battles and Campaigns/ Other People (in progress); Uniforms, Source Criticismetc.
(Hence my previous question about replying...)

I understand the Russian matter- I have a copy* of Gingerichs site where he enummerates ALL the regiments uniforms, so I should have consulted that first.

On 'Lad down the "bastard" it gives it on the internet' - I could not decipher what the translation was telling me. In English it is a bad curse word, but in uniformology or armies, I don't get it.

*JonathanG had a free site that went off line several times- as I was just developing my 1805 'Russian' enemy (army) so I took a copy for safekeeping and permanent reference (also his Austerlitz OB page) for myself. Lucky i did as he's not restored it online.

Respect and regards, dave

[Prince of Essling]

Main text from Appendix VI page 437 in “Crisis in the Snows – Russia confronts Napoleon, The Eylau Campaign 1806-07� by James R Arnold & Ralph R Reinertsen has the following order of battle for L’Estocq’s Corps (supplemented with details from pages 411 & 412 which is shown in square brackets)


[General-Leutenant Anton Wilhelm] von L’Estocq in Command
Prussian Corps to Eylau – L’Estocq – 9 ½ battalions, 28 squadrons, 5 sotnias, 2 batteries with 16 guns

Advance Guard and supports
Auer Dragoons (Nr 6) – 9 squadrons
Bredow Horse Battery (nr 8)
Russian Cossacks – Colonel Gordejov – 5 sotnias

3^rd Division – [Colonel Johann Kasimir] von Auer
Towarczys Corps (Nr 9) – 10 squadrons
Half of Decker’s Horse Battery (Nr 10)
Viborg Musketeers (Russian regiment) – 3 battalions

2^nd Division – [General-Major Michael Szabginsky] von Rembow
Schöning Infantry (Nr 11) – 2 battalions

1^st Division – [General-Major Otto Friederick] von Diericke
Fabecky Grenadier Battalion [formed from grenadier companies of Regiments Nr 14 & 16]
Rüchel Infantry (Nr 2) – 2 battalions
Backzo Dragoons (Nr 7) – 5 squadrons
Wagenfeld Cuirassiers (Nr 4) – 4 squadrons
Half of Renzel’s Horse Battery (Nr 13)

Left to Guard the Bridge at Althof
Schliessen Grenadier Battalion (2^nd Division) [formed from grenadier companies of Regiments Nr 2 & 11]
Stutterheim Fusiliers (Nr 21) – 2 companies

Prussian Troops started with L’Estocq toward Eylau, formed rear guard then retired to Kreuzburg
Rear (previously Advance) Guard Brigade – [Colonel Moritz] von Prittwitz
Prittwitz Hussars (Nr 5) – 5 squadrons
Stutterheim Fusiliers (Nr 21) – 2 companies
Half of Sowinsky’s Horse Battery (Nr 6)

Prussian Troops to march with L’Estocq, however delayed in march then forced to retire to Kreuzburg
Reserve – [General-Leutenant Johann Ernst] von Plötz
Rüts Infantry (Nr 8 m) – 2 battalions
Plötz Infantry (Nr 42) – 2 battalions
Chlebowski Infantry (Nr 60) – 2 companies
Braun Grenadier Battalion [formed from grenadier companies of Regiments Nr 31 & 46]
Wagenfeld Cuirassiers (Nr 4) – 1 squadron
Weitzmann Horse Battery (Nr 9)

With baggage train sent to Muhlhausen on the Eylau-Konigsberg Road
Chlebowski Infantry (Nr 60) – 2 companies
Auer Dragoons (Nr 6) – 1 squadron

[Kein Prinz]

Thanks Ian,
A new data set to compare. Theres a bit of change to prior notes but I expect I'll work it out.
Am I going to create another cossack unit- no I expect I'll enjoy the privelege of using a decent enough looking 'stand-in'!

Nice to meet again across the water so to speak.
Regards, davew

[Spaen]

zu #4:

[Kein Prinz]

zu #4:

Reason?
We're not all experts on such matters... I can see discrepencies, but I was prepared to work through them...

[Spaen]

Reason? Zu den Begebenheiten bei der preußischen Armee 1807 in "Polen" liegt eine Menge ausgezeichneter deutscher Literatur vor, welche die Ereignisse und die ständig wechselnden OdB detailliert abbildet. Deswegen ist ein Ausweichen zu dem oft problematischen englischen "Zweitaufguss" weder in diesem noch in anderen Fällen aus meiner, vielleicht eher eingeschränkten, persönlichen Sicht meistens nicht notwendig. Den Kriegsverlauf setzte ich als bekannt voraus. Deshalb erübrigen sich dazu meinerseits weitere Einlassungen.

Das beigegebene Bild schließt inhaltlich an den u. a. bei Jany , Band III, Seite 609 beschriebenen Sachverhalt, nämlich die Eroberung eines französischen Adlers durch das Regiment Towarczys an und zeigt die Präsentation des erbeuteten Stückes am Abend der Schlacht.


preußisch-eylau_0001.jpg

[Spaen]

Vielleicht ist die nachfolgende kurze Nebeninformation zum Thema Preußisch Eylau, obwohl zu diesem Forum wohl weniger passend, trotzdem für Einige interessant.

Beim erfolgreichen Angriff auf Kutschitten stand im Zentrum des ersten Treffens das russische Infanterie-Regiment Wyborg, welches direkt auf das Dorf angesetzt war, flankierend rechts und links die preußischen Regimenter Schöning und Rüchel.
Das dürfte ein wesentlicher Grund für Kaiser Wilhelm II. gewesen sein in späterer Zeit die Chefstelle dieses russischen Regiments einzunehmen. Zum 200. Regimentsjubiläum im Jahre 1900 gratulierte auch eine besondere preußische Abordnung im Namen des Kaisers unter Leitung des Obersten Graf York von Wartenburg. U.a. überreichte der Militärattaché Major Lauenstein ein Porträt des Kaisers in der Uniform "seines" Regiments.

Beigegeben das Jubiläumsbild mit den historischen Uniformen seit dem Bestehen.

wyborg.jpg

[Kein Prinz]

Spaen
Danke schön for the explanation.
The translator still makes a mess of 'oft problematischen englischen "Zweitaufguss"' but if I understand anything, yes English isn't the best source of material.

So many people are incapable of understanding the dynamics of actions, history or even the modern world- so I do look for specifics more and more. The current generation seems (as I read on Reddit)- incapable of doing any research, finding books or information (even what we know is already on the web) etc...

I'm equally frustrated by the demi-gods of academia producing rote heresay and unbalanced (if not biased) publications merely for the game of life.
The French have ruined their own patch in recent decades to an extent by the poorly addressed issues that they want to beat the Brits at their own game, yet still allow doodles and heresay artwork to abound. With due respect to Ian and his American sources, they too are often adrift of the truth about things I find.

Thanks for the engravings, most impressive!
I am all but ready to invest a small amount into a force of L'ESTOCQ men, yet I am waiting for the ultimate unit to be modelled for me to begin, these infamous Towarczys that are a must!

Thank you once again
dave